Monday, 10 September 2012

Copper Underwing agg ??


Still struggle with these two......

6 comments:

grampybustard said...

Are they the same way round in both photos, i.e. moth A on the left in both?

AndyC said...

Sorry , No opposite way round .

grampybustard said...

Funny enough, have similar deliberations ongoing on the Dorset Moths Facebook site at the moment. I don't think you could get two more extreme looking individuals as this, and have never noticed such a size difference, which may be a male/female thing here I suppose. On the dorsal pic, i.e. the first one, I would say the features clearly indicate Copper Underwing left and Svensson's on the right. The palps do not seem to fit this but as a feature are considered unreliable. Wear is a real spanner in the works, but the upper crossline feature looks good here and perhaps significant that SCU was known as Drab Copper Underwing by some. Obviously no indication on the strength of the body markings or the extent of the copper underwing would help further.

AndyC said...

Many thanks for that.
I would agree Copper underwing on the right top pic the body markings and extent of underwing colour also indicated this on both individuals .It was the palp colour that was in question once again.
Hope to get a few more before the dark nights draw in.all the best.andy

brian leecy said...

Umm interesting conundrum,perhaps the only sure fire way is Gen Det !!

grampybustard said...

After further consideration and looking at all the available latest information I think that both may be Copper Underwing. This is taking the angle of the upper crossline where it joins outer edge on both being acute, the extended mid inner wing teeth on upper crossline (which point to the orbicular stigma) and the neat round orbicular stigma. The size difference is purely down to sexual dimorphism I think. It would be good to confirm the extent of the copper on the underwing. The palps, I find. are the least reliable feature.